Clint, Natasha and Agents of SHIELD

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

Hello lovely comm! I've been mulling this topic over for a few weeks now, and decided that on this wonderful long holiday weekend I would share my Clint/Natasha thinky-thoughts as they pertain to Marvel's Agents of SHIELD. Beware of spoilers for all episodes, including the most recent. I'm hoping to spur some discussion, some speculation... maybe inspire some fic... *looks hopeful*




1) I don't have any desire whatsoever to engage in or instigate character-bashing, but I'm assuming that I'm not the only person on this comm who groaned - loudly - at the comparison between Ward's espionage skills and Natasha's. :D

2) As of the episode The Hub, we know that Coulson is a Level 8 agent, Ward and May are Level 7, and (I think) Fitz and Simmons are Level 5. So, what level are Clint and Natasha? High enough to have gotten the memo that Coulson is alive? Maria says the Avengers don't know, that "they're not level 7" (Like that could stop Tony...) but is she just referring to the Big Four?

3) Speaking of the Hub (which looked to me like a giant mall for SHIELD agents) one has to assume that there's all kinds of sub-Level 7 agents walking around there at any given time, any who could have seen Coulson, which has to mean he's not such a big secret after all. I would <3 fic about Clint and Natasha at the Hub, running into an old friend, or maybe just hearing about what happened to Sitwell ;)

4) "Barton, Romanoff... they never have an extraction plan."
"They know that going in."

I squealed. I'll admit it.

5) In the most recent episode, Repairs, we learn about a SHIELD Academy, and how pranks were played on freshmen/rookies. Have Clint and Natasha been to the Academy? Were they ever considered rookies by other agents (with predictable/hysterical/disastrous results) or someone trying to give them the "full experience?"

Comments

[spyforaday.livejournal.com]

LOVED the extraction plan comment. Loved it! I'm writing a fic right now based on it, in fact. It's not turning out like I'd hoped (they rarely do!), but it might be ready for prime time in the next week or two.

Like you, I've been wondering about Coulson just walking around, flashing his badge, being at active sites, at The Hub, and just generally "out there." Not sure that's the best practice for keeping his secret...

**spoiler alert**

Based on the "exit plan" proposed by Agent Ward to Agent May in the beginning of the most recent episode, one would have to assume that, um, "agent fraternization" is frowned upon. Wonder how/if that could play into future Barton/Romanoff interactions.

[hufflepuffsneak.livejournal.com]

*spoiler convo*

But the fact that two relatively by the books people did do that suggests it's not prohibited...

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

one would have to assume that, um, "agent fraternization" is frowned upon. Wonder how/if that could play into future Barton/Romanoff interactions.

True. Unless they just didn't want everyone else knowing their business ;)

spoiler conversation

[dragonacesg7.livejournal.com]

I more got the impression that sleeping together can't affect a team
since half the team are excitable, them knowing might cause distractions.

That's just my guess

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

I just assumed they didn't want the others to know/gossip.

[hufflepuffsneak.livejournal.com]

I'm sooo ready for semi-Hogwarts fic about Natasha and Clint taking brief stints as instructors at the Academy.

And I want to know what Natasha, Clint and Steve are up to! Wouldn't it be funny if we had an episode with some combination of them doing a self-contained story in the background?

[spyforaday.livejournal.com]

I like the "Academy." So many possibilities! Really hope they run with that.

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

SHIELD Hogwarts, yes! I would love to see our dynamic duo through the eyes of a bunch of SHIELD 'freshmen.'

[happilydancing.livejournal.com]

I haven't watched the newest episode yet but I am always up for an AoS discussion!

The comment about Ward being just below Romonov's scores on espionage didn't bother me?? Now if they said he was better than her, I would have had a problem with that. ;)

I LOOOOOVVVEEDDD the comment about them never having an extraction plan!!! No wonder they are fricken Avengers, being the baddest of the SHIELD bad-asses.

I need to watch this latest ep!!

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

It didn't bother me, per se, I guess, but I found it snort-worthy ;)

I LOOOOOVVVEEDDD the comment about them never having an extraction plan!!! No wonder they are fricken Avengers, being the baddest of the SHIELD bad-asses.

Yes!

[dragonacesg7.livejournal.com]

maybe those are Natasha's scores that are able to be seen by level 7?

I always wonder what they base scoring for that stuff on.

And now I have the urge to play Deus Ex again...

SPOILERS through ep 9

[dragonacesg7.livejournal.com]

I'm going to say that the 'guess' that Natasha is Skye's mother is not something I believe.

For starters, not sure how old they are making Natasha and in the episode that Phil got the information there were images of a woman who appeared to be dead in the documents May was holding.

I get this image in my head of Clint saying something to the effect of "Hey Nat, what's an extraction plan?"
"Hell if I know," Nat answering with a smirk.

I am pleased they weren't using May as a Natasha stand in, that was my fear at first.

I know it's not Clint/Nat related but anyone else heartbroken when we got confirmation she not only slept with Ward at teh end of 'The Well' but that she's been continuing to sleep with him?

I am all for May having independent sexuality, but hearing Coulson explain what really happened to earn her the name, Calvary, he sounded almost as if he were going to cry and, at least I feel, there is a damn deep connection between the two.

I DO like the suggestion that May and Natasha have sparred before. I don't think Natasha was her handler, she doesn't seem like the person they would hand such an assignment to. That is NOTHING against Natasha, it's more she's in the field so much, as a spy, it wouldn't be practical unless they were training May for that and it isn't the impression I got.

Do people think Nat and Clint know Phil is alive? They are level 7, but they are Avengers.

I believe Phil tries to keep tabs on his 'babies' if he's able but is probably damn worried about them both.

Re: SPOILERS through ep 9

[happilydancing.livejournal.com]

Oooh, now I really want to watch this ep!! How did she earn the nickname??

Re: SPOILERS through ep 9

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

I am all for May having independent sexuality, but hearing Coulson explain what really happened to earn her the name, Calvary, he sounded almost as if he were going to cry and, at least I feel, there is a damn deep connection between the two.

Yeah, they're Mom and Dad :\

Re: SPOILERS through ep 9

[sgteam14283.livejournal.com]

I get this image in my head of Clint saying something to the effect of "Hey Nat, what's an extraction plan?"
"Hell if I know," Nat answering with a smirk.

AhhHHHHH I can totally see that happening! :D

And since it's Clint he would ask during the most inopportune moment, like when they were surrounded by the bad guys or running away from the building that's on fire with everyone chasing after them, lol.

Re: SPOILERS through ep 9

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

We really don't know how old MCU Natasha is although it could go either way. From her looks and most things, it would be assumed that she would be Scarlett's physical age but...

She reads and speaks Latin, a "dead language".She knows seemingly everything which would make her either a savant similar to Tony who can pick up stuff easily OR she's has decades to do it.

She also used the term "swoon" which could have been for Steve's benefit because she knew he would know it OR she knew it because she came from that time as well and he was bringing it out in her. There was something else that made me wonder but I can't remember what it was now.

And then you have her being BFFS/maybe more with Steve in the new movie and bringing in Winter Soldier which makes me wonder how much of the original plotline they will be doing...

I need to watch that episode again and freeze frame on the documents because I saw none of this.

I think I was the only one happy at May/Ward.
Yes, I totally shipped May/Coulson but May/Ward was so unexpected and then, the whole older woman getting younger man was pretty cool...definitely seems to add canon to the fanon that anything goes at SHIELD...

Then, there was a selfish wish fulfillment...if May and Ward can do this without being caught by Phil and/or Phil just not caring, then that means my fic which has two characters in a similar relationship under his nose isn't so far-fetched...and I had worried that it was...

I doubt there are any feelings involved with Ward and May. This is just sexual/tension release.

Hearing him tell the story actually made me start shipping them platonically as more like BFFs/siblings than actual lovers although I'm sure they have in the past.

Since they are level 7, that's what I assumed unless...that's why Natasha, Clint and Steve keep getting sent out into the field? To keep them from finding out about Phil?

I did notice that Phil said he knew Thor in present tense as though he could simply call him up...which was a bluff but was the whole thing a bluff or are they allowed to know at this point?

[happilydancing.livejournal.com]

Does anyone else love Fitz and Simmons? I just ADORE THEM TO PIECES.

[dragonacesg7.livejournal.com]

YES!

those two are so awesome

[spyforaday.livejournal.com]

Yes. After the first episode I was afraid they would annoy me, but they have turned into my favorite characters. After Coulson, of course.

[sgteam14283.livejournal.com]

It's nice to know that I wasn't the only one to roll my eye's at the comparison…

My personal head cannon is that Clint and Natasha know, but the rest of the team (Tony, Thor, and Bruce) don't; Pepper knows as well but likes keeping it from Tony while Steve suspects something but is too busy to figure it out. Clint was really angry when he was told the truth but eventually calmed down and was glad that Phil was actually alive. Natasha was miffed but not to the degree that Clint was.

I think that the whole "Coulson's actually alive" secret is kinda like Torchwood-the higher ups thinks it's a secret, but in reality everyone knows but doesn't talk about it.

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

I also want to know how pissed Coulson was when he found out what Fury had done to his Cap trading cards ;)

[alphaflyer.livejournal.com]

I'm actually writing a whole fic (well, a chapter to one of my longer pieces) about this whole thing ... now if I could only get it done ... :-)

[chrisfaithalin.livejournal.com]

One of my small pet peeves with the show is that it's known that Clint and Natasha are both level 7. So either they don't count as "Avengers" (which they SO do) or it was a slip up. I remember when the studios released those personnel files and id cards, that stuff said they were level 7, so yeah they should know. I just don't get why they wouldn't know or why it's so secretive that Coulson be hidden. Everybody is buying the story that he just healed, so why does it matter? Also, there are always agents around to help as support, it's hard for me to believe they are all level 7. If Ward, who seems like a very competent agent, was only level 6, I find it hard to believe that all of the lackies are level 7. And the same goes for The Hub. That's a great point.

I have put way too much thought into this. In my head canon, Coulson was in charge of Strike Team Delta and I like to think the three of them were close. So, in my world Clint and Natasha know about Coulson. Not to mention if Coulson was Clint's handler in any way, it seems like it would be good to tell him that he's not responsible for Coulson's death.

With all of this nitpicking, I do love the show and it grows on me every week. But the whole Coulson secret thing seems like an oversight on their part.

[happilydancing.livejournal.com]

I agree, I think it wasn't completely thought out, so I'm curious to see how they are going to address it...nobody is like "OMG, Phil!! You are alive!!!" Like that one agent was like "oh, you are alive, interesting." Although, probably for SHIELD, stuff like that happens all the time lol.

[alphaflyer.livejournal.com]

So I missed the last AoS Ep because I was on a flight to India. Then I missed this Fab Discussion because I was on a flight from India.

Sometimes, my life sucks.

That said, MAY AND WARD ARE A THING NOW???? Yay!!!!!!! That is all.

[sgteam14283.livejournal.com]

yeah…well I guess they are. It was implied that they've hooked up before at the beginning of the most recent episode and I feel completely fine with it since Ward and May seem to actually get each other and seem a better fit than Sky and Ward-which I feel the show was trying to push but then kinda backed off of….but that's just my opinion, lol.

[ericadawn16.livejournal.com]

1. I'm now of the opinion that they said that to butter him up at the time but they know he's nowhere near that good.

Why do I think buttering up was necessary considering his ego is through the roof?

He didn't want to work with Coulson.

2. Let me go check my briefcase set...

Okay, briefcase set confirms that Romanov and Barton are both level 7. However...

It's kind of like the sports team thing...at least I think it is...
Take Peyton Manning. He plays for the Broncos now but just today, a customer was proudly wearing his Colts jersey.

Why?

Because even though he plays for the new team, he will always be a Colt in that person's eyes because he was on their team first. He was one of them.

Natasha and Clint might be Avengers but they also work for SHIELD and they worked for SHIELD first. Every single employee who knew them before New York would think of them as equals aside from the clearance levels. Quite a few are probably quite proud of having two of the Avengers be from SHIELD rather than Tony, Bruce and Thor who seemed to stumble into membership.

Steve is a whole other issue because I doubt Phil is the only SHIELD employee to idolize him and he does seem very entwined...after all, they defrosted him BUT...
Steve doesn't trust SHIELD and in the new film, someone seems to want him dead and destroy SHIELD as we know it.

Thus, I don't know about Steve...because he's bound to find out but then he would be deeply pissed...
Unless he found out how in the dark even Coulson is...
But then...an enemy could get him to find out just to play into his plans...

So many possibilities...

I'm very happy Sitwell was promoted and knows Coulson's alive after Item 47.

3. This did surprise me. Actually, the show makes it clear how huge SHIELD is in a way I never really thought of before. I just assumed they used resources from others, like when they use Stark and others as a consultant, but this makes it clear that they have bases and everything else...well, actually, it's SHIELD from the comic book except that it was harder to grasp in a comic book rather than live action on a television.

4. I squealed but it wasn't just the mention. It was the mention in PRESENT TENSE!

First of all, ever since the first Thor spoilers about Selvig being weird, I'd been worried. After all, they make Selvig into a nutcase and Clint's nowhere to be seen in any of the films? Uhoh
However, he's mentioned in present tense so he must be fine or at least as fine as Coulson.

It also means that whenever we don't see him or Natasha in Iron Man 3 or Thor 2, it's because they were on missions out of sight, woot! An explanation!

5. They actually had this academy thing in the comics and I know I assumed that agents would have to go through training and all...but I assumed it would be more like On the Job Training on the HeliCarrier or wherever was convenient instead of an actual base.